竹島問題の歴史

14.10.07

Japan's 1907 "Joseon Seaways Directory" (朝鮮水路誌)

The following are translations of the "Takeshima (Liancourt Rocks)" section from the 1907 edition of Japan's Joseon Seaways Directory. One item of interest from the directory is that it says that Japanese fishermen used the name "Yangko" to refer to Liancourt Rocks, and Koreans wrote the name of the island as "Dokdo" (獨島), which was first reported by the Japanese naval vessel Niitaka in 1904. In a 1903 document, however, it was written that Korean fisherman used the Japanese name for Liancourt Rocks, which suggests that Koreans had recently just learned of the rocks from the Japanese. Before 1903, there are no records or maps to suggest that Koreans ever visited Liancourt Rocks.

By the way, the name "Dokdo" (獨島) literally means "Solitary Island," and was a name regularly used to describe such islands in old Korean documents. In fact, Ulleungdo had also been described as a "Dokdo." Therefore, it is quite possible that "Dokdo" was first used as a descriptive term by Korean fishermen, who later adopted it as their name for Liancourt Rocks. The fact that Korean fishermen never used "Usando" to refer to Liancourt Rocks is more evidence against Korea's claim that Usando was the old name for the rocks.

Here are the English translation for the Sea of Japan and the Takeshima section (Liancourt Rocks) and the Korean translation for the Takeshima section in Japan's 1907 Joseon Seaways Directory:

The SEA of JAPAN

The Sea is bounded on the east and south by the Japan islands, and on the west and north-west by the coasts of Korea and Russian Tartary is about 900 miles long, NNE and SSW, and 600 miles East and West, at its broadest part. Surrounded by land on all sides, this sea is only accessible by the following narrow passages:- To the south by the Korea strait, which connects it with the China sea; to the east by La Perouse and Tsugar straits, by which it communicates with the Pacific; and to the north by the gulf of Tartary, through which it communicates with the sea of Okhotsk by the gulf of Amur; this sea is, as far as is known, clear of rocks or dangers with the following exceptions: Liancourt Rocks, Matsu Sima (Dagelet island) and Waywoda Rock.

TAKESHIMA (Liancourt Rocks)

The island was named after the French ship Liancourt, which discovered them in 1849; they were also called "Menalai and Olivutsa rocks" by the Russian frigate Pallas in 1854, and Hornet islands by H.M.S. Hornet in 1855. Koreans write them as "獨島," and Japanese fishermen call them "Yangko." They are a small group of islets located about eighty nautical ri from Oki Island and fifty nautical ri from Ulleungdo. They are made up of two islands and several small islets. The two islands are separated by a narrow waterway that is about a quarter ri wide and face each other from east and west. The west island, elevated about 410 feet above the sea, has a sugar-loaf form. The east island is relatively low and flat-topped. Most of the many small islets that surround them are flat rocks that bearly break the surface of the water. Most are big enough that a tatami of tens of jang could be laid out on them. Both islands are desolate and bare and are completely exposed to the wind and sea. There is not even one tree, only a little grass growing on the east island. The slopes of the islands are sheer precipices with some layering of rocks. There are many strange-looking caves, but they cannot be reached. These caves and the small islets are the breeding grounds for sea lions. The naval vessel Tsushima measured the depth of the waters around this island and said that it measured the depth at about fifty-eight fathoms at a spot about nine ryeon (0.9 nautical ri) from the southern tip of the east island. The island is a little dangerous because it is near navigation routes in the Sea of Japan.

Level Ground on the Island

There is no level ground on the island. Even though the waterway between the two islands is narrow, there are two or three flat, gravel patches there, but it would be difficult to avoid the assault of the waves. There is some flat land at the summit of the East Island, but there is no path leading up there. There is only a small patch of about three or four pyeong on the southern tip that blocks the northwesterly wind. The ridge spine of the West Island runs east to west. The slope of the upper half of the ridge is almost vertical, but the slope of the lower half is fairly gentle, so the cliffs can be reached. Therefore, if the hard rocks of this section can be excavated, then there would seem to be access to flat land sheltered from all wind except that from the east. As per above, there is absolutely no land on this island suitable for building a house. In November of the 37th year of Meiji (1904), it was said that the naval ship Tsushima found a small thatched hut for fishermen on the east island, but it was badly damaged by the wind and waves. It is said that each summer dozens of people come from Ulleungdo to this island to catch sea lions, and that they build a shelter and stay for about ten days each trip.

Fresh Water

There is a cave on the southwest corner of the west island where a fair amount of water falls from the ceiling rocks, but it falls like rain, so it would be difficult to gather. There are a few springs along the midway section from the summit where water comes out, but they are so polluted by the excrement of the sea lions that they give off an odor, so they are absolutely not suitable for drinking. It is said that the fisherman who come here to catch sea lions use the water on this island for cooking, but the water they use for their tea is brought from somewhere else.

Location: According to the results of a survey by the American naval vessel New York in 1902, Takeshima is at a northern latitude of 37 degrees 9 minutes 30 seconds and an eastern longitude of 131 degrees 55 minutes.

ULLEUNGDO or MATSUSHIMA (Dagelet island)

It is semicircular island with a circumfererence of 18 nautical ri (浬 = nautical miles). The whole island is a collection of sharp conical hills, densely covered with trees, and supports an imposing peak in the center, at latitude 37° 30′ N. and longitude 130° 53′ E, that rises 3,208 shaku [feet]. Jukdo (Boussole Rock) is off the northeast shore, and about two and three-quarter nautical ri (浬) west-southwest of there is a rock where the water is two to three shaku (feet) deep. There are several rock islets offshore, especially, on the north and east sides. Some reach a height of 400 to 500 shaku (feet). They are all, like the island, steep, and the lead affords no warning, but none of them are more than a quarter of a mile from the cliffs, except for Boussole Rock, the largest, which is seven ren (cables) off the northeast shore. Hole Rock, off the north shore, is remarkable in that it has a large hole, or rather a natural archway, through it. On shore almost facing the rock is a smooth but very steep, sugar-loaf-shaped, bare granite rock that is about 800 shaku [feet] high. There is also a rock off Seal Point, at the southern tip. The sides of the island are so steep that soundings could only be obtained by going up almost to the base of the cliffs. Landing may be effected in fine weather, with difficulty, on some small gravel beaches, which occur at intervals, but the greater part of the island is quite inaccessible.

Korean residents were eight-five families with 260 people (175 men and 85 women), according to a survey at the end of December 1904. However, they increased to 110 families with 366 people (219 men and 147 women) by the end of June 1905. However, because these residents live next to the land they cultivate, their houses lie scattered, and there are only eight villages. The island has an island chief living there. The Japanese on the island are mainly woodcutters, carpenters, fishermen, sailors, and brokers. There are few other professionals. The Japanese population was 230 at the end of June 1905.

Climate

The hot and cold temperature differences on the island are not extreme. Southerly winds prevail from April to September while northerly winds prevail from October to March, with an especially strong northwest wind in November. They have snow from the end of October to the end of March. Sometimes there is still snow on the top of the mountain in May. The place is very healthy. There have been no epidemics, such as smallpox. The islanders attribute it to the good quality of the water.

Products

The island's main product is soybeans. Others include barley, millet, barnyard grass, and potatoes. The average soybean yield is 3,000 to 4,000 koku annually, while the other grains are raised for the consumption of the residents. There is usually no shortage of food. The fishing on the island is mainly for abalone. Each year a great deal of dried abalone is exported. A sea animal called a sea lion lives on an island called Takeshima (Liancourt rocks), which is located southeast of the island. The people on this island (Ulleungdo) began to catch them sometime about 1904. The hunting season is six months, from April to September. There are three boats that hunt for sea lions, and each boat catches an average of five. The abalone which the Japanese catch are caught by using two diving apparatuses and two steamships, and they say that the average catch per day is 1,130 kin. There are no wild animals on the island, but wildcats and pigeons are sometimes visible. As to the wood available, there are lots of zelkova and pine.

Exports and Imports

The island's exports include soybean, zelkova wood, dried abalone, sea lion skins, sea lion oil, and the squeezed dregs of sea lions. Its imports include polished rice, rice, sake (rice wine), shochu (clear distilled liquor), petroleum, sugar, cotton, cotton yarn, cotton fabrics, iron, straw bags, matches, ceramic ware, tableware, soy sauce, and somen (thin wheat noodles). The total export revenue from April to June in 1905 was 12,075 yen, and the total imports was 3,116 yen.

Available Products

In each village, a few chickens and eggs are available at cheap prices. Clear water is available at various places and and is said to be of good quality.

Korean Translation for the Takeshima Section

竹島(다께시마)(Liancourt rocks): 1849년 프랑스 선박 <리앙꼬르>가 이를 발견하여 라 칭하고 있으며, 1854년 러시아 함대 [팔라스]는 라고 하였다. 1855년 영국 함정 <호네트>는 이를 라고 부른다. 한인(韓人)들은 [獨島]라 쓰고, 일본어부들은 [リアンコ(리앙꼬)]島라고 한다. 이 섬은 일본해에 있는 하나의 작은 군도로 오끼국 섬에서 약 80해리, 울릉도에서 약 50해리 떨어진 곳에 위치하며 폭 4분지 1해리의 좁은 수도를 사이에 두고 동서로 대응하는 두 개의 섬과 그 주위에 있는 여러 작은 섬들로 구성된다. 서도(西島)는 해면상 높이가 약 410척이고 봉당(棒糖) 모양을 이루고 있고, 동도(東島)는 비교적 낮고 정상에 평탄한 땅이 있으며, 주위의 여러 조그만 섬들은 대개 편편한 암석으로 약간 수면에 노출되어 있고 그 크기는 대부분 수십 장의 다다미를 깔기에 충분하다. 두 섬 모두 황폐한 민둥산으로 해풍에 완전히 노출되어 있어서 한 그루의 수목도 없으며, 동도에 약간의 풀이 자랄 뿐이다. 섬 기슭은 단애절벽이고 약한 석층을 이루어 기이한 모양의 동굴이 많지만 오를 수가 없다. 이러한 동굴이나 조그만 섬들은 바다사자들의 서식지가 된다. 이 섬 부근 수심은 군함 對馬호가 동도 남단으로부터 북서방 약 9련(0.9해리) 떨어진 곳에서 58패텀의 수심을 얻었다고 한다. 이 섬은 그 위치상 일본해를 항해하는 선박의 항로에 가까워서 야간에 위험하다.

島上의 平地: 섬의 평지는 없고, 수도의 양측에 협소하지만 평탄한 자갈밭이 두 세 군데 있지만 모두 파도의 침습을 면하기 어렵다. 동도(東島)는 그 정상에 평탄한 땅이 있긴 하지만 이곳에 오르는 길이 없고, 오직 섬의 남단에 북서풍을 막아주는 3-4평의 작은 평지가 있을 뿐이다. 서도(西島)는 그 동서에 산등성이가 있는데, 그 상반부는 거의 직립해 있으나, 하반부는 경사가 꽤 완만해서 그 절반 부분까지 도달할 수 있고, 이 부근의 견암을 개착하면 동풍을 제외한 외풍을 막을만한 평지를 얻을 수 있을 것으로 보였다. 섬에는 위와 같이 가옥을 지을만한 땅이 전혀 없었고, 明治 37년(1904) 11월 군함 對馬호가 이 섬을 실사했을 때 동도에 어부용 작은 초가집이 있었으나 풍랑으로 심히 파괴되어 있었다고 한다. 매년 여름철이 되면 바다사자를 잡기 위해서 울릉도에서 넘어오는 사람이 수 십 명에 이르며, 그들은 섬에 조그만 거처를 만들어 매회 약 10일간 임시로 거주한다고 한다.


담수(淡水): 서도(西島)의 남서쪽 구석에 하나의 동굴이 있고, 그 천정 부분 암석에서 떨어지는 물의 양이 상당히 많지만, 빗물이 떨어지는 것 같아서 이를 받는데 어려움이 있다. 산 정상에서 중턱을 따라 몇 군데 물이 나오는 샘이 있으나 바다사자들의 분뇨로 오염되어 악취를 풍겨서 도저히 음료용으로는 적합하지 않다. 바다사자를 잡기 위해 오는 어부들은 이 섬에서 나는 물을 받아서 취사용으로는 쓰지만, 차로 마시는 물은 다른 곳에서 가지고 온 물을 사용한다고 한다.

위치(位置): 竹島(다께시마)는 1902년 실시한 미국 함정 <뉴욕>호의 검측에 의하면 북위 37도 9분 30초, 동경 131도 55분에 있다.

56 comments:

  1. Has anyone seen scans of the relevant pages from the 1907 directory on the Web? I could not find any on Mr. Tanaka's site.

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  2. Gerry,

    Here it is:
    http://www.han.org/a/half-moon/shiryou/shisho_jpn/suiroshi/korea_suiro_V2_1907.pdf

    It's from Half-moon's site.

    BTW, I noticed that thre is a writing in the beginning by Kimotsuki, which expalins the origins of information. Some are from Japan's information while some are British. The 5th chapter (in which Liancourt rocks was written) seems to have written on the basis of British waterway journal (1884, Vol.4).

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  3. Gerry,

    It is interesting to read the chapter of Ulleungdo in the book:

    韓人の住民は明治37年12月末の調査によれば戸数85、人口260、うち男175女85なりしが38年6月末には戸数110、人口366、うち男219女147に増加せり。

    Korean residents were 260 with 85 families, 175 men and 85 women, according to the examination in the end of December 1904. However, they increased to 366 with 110 families, 219 men and 147 women, in the end of June 1905.

    然れども該住民はその開墾せる耕地の付近に住するをもって家屋は各所に散在し村落をなすものは8箇所に過ぎず。本島には島監在住せり。

    However, because these residents live beside their arable land they cultivated, their houses lie scattered and there are only 8 villages. There is an island chief living in the island.

    本島に在留する本邦人は木挽、大工、漁夫、船乗および仲買商を最としその他諸種の職業に従事せる者にして明治38年6月末にはその数約230人となりし。

    Japanese who are staying in the island are mainly woodcutters, carpenters, fishermen, sailors and brokers. There are a few other professionals. The population became 230 in the end of June 1905.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    The text above explains that Korean residents were farmers who cultivated and lived beside the cultivated land. While Japanese are doing various jobs including fishery.

    And to follow is from the same text:
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    トドと称する海獣は本島より南東方なる竹島(Liancourt rocks)に棲息し明治37年頃より本島民之を捕獲し始め捕獲期は4月より9月に至る6ヶ月間にして現今本業に従事する漁船3組(一組につき平均約5頭を捕獲す)あり。また本邦人の採取する鮑は・・・

    The sea animal called sea lion is living on an island called Takeshima (Liancourt rocks) which locates southeast from this island (Ulleungdo). The islanders of this island (Ulleungdo) began to catch them since circa 1904. The catching period is 6 months from April to september. The engaging fish boats are three for now and they catch 5 sea lions in average for each of the fish boat. The abalone whcih Japanese catch is...

    - - - - - - - - - - -
    The "islanders" should mean Japanese people (maybe including Nakai?), as the text only mentions Japanese fishery (catching abalones etc).

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  4. Thanks for the link, Pacifist.

    Yes, the Ulleungdo section does look interesting, but I could not find a Korean translation for that section.

    As for Nakai Yozaburo and his people, the June 1905 log, HERE, of the Japanese naval ship Hashidate said that Nakai's men were coming from Oki Island to hunt sea lions. Of course, Nakai and his people could have moved back to Ulleungdo by 1907.

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  5. Gerry,

    To follow is the translation of the part of Ulleungdo:

    - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    Ulleungdo aka Matsushima (Dagelet island)

    It is a semicircular-shaped island with the 18-ri circumference, it comprises of several sharp conical mountains with thick trees. At the center of the island, N 37°30 min E 130°53 min, a mountain of 3,208-shaku high is present and is rising high.
    There are 竹嶼 (Jukdo) [Boussole rock] at the northeast coast of the island and a rock at about 2 and 3/4-ri (sea miles) south by southwest 1/4 west of 2 or 3-shaku depth under water.
    There are several rock islets at coasts of the island. Several rocks at the north coast and the east coast are high as 400 or 500-shaku. All of these rocks are *** as well as the main island so that no caution won’t be needed to measure the depth of the water. There are no islets that locate outside of 1/4-ri distance (from the main island), except for the largest one – Jukdo. Only Jukdo locates at 7-ren from the northeast coast.
    The Hole rock at the north coast has a naturally bored-through arch shaped gate and is remarkable. At the almost opposite shore of this rock, there is a ca 800-shaku high bald granite hill with a sugar-candy shape. There is a rock at the southernmost tip of the island, Seal point.
    The sides of the island are steep cliffs so that you can’t put the sinker to the bottom of the water unless you go to the right under the cliff. However, there are small gravel beaches - if you are going to land, you should put the end of the boat on the gravel beach when the waves are not high. No other places are hard to climb.

    Korean residents were 260 with 85 families, 175 men and 85 women, according to the examination in the end of December 1904. However, they increased to 366 with 110 families, 219 men and 147 women, in the end of June 1905.
    However, because these residents live beside their arable land they cultivated, their houses lie scattered and there are only 8 villages. There is an island chief living in the island.
    Japanese who are staying in the island are mainly woodcutters, carpenters, fishermen, sailors and brokers. There are a few other professionals. The population became 230 in the end of June 1905.

    Climate
    Heat and cold are not extreme in the island. South winds prevail from April to September while north winds prevail from October to March, especially strong northwest wind blows in November. They have snow from the end of October to the end of March. Sometimes there is remaining snow at the top of the mountain still in May.
    The land is very good for health, there has been no epidemic like smallpox. The islanders say that it attributes to the good quality of water.

    Products
    Main product is soybean. Others include barley, millet, barnyard grass, and potato. The crop of soybean is 3,000 to 4,000-koku yearly in average, while other grains are for the daily foods of the residents. Usually there is no shortage of daily foods. The main fishery is abalone catching. Lots of dried abalones are exported every year. The sea animal called sea lion is living on an island called Takeshima (Liancourt rocks) which locates southeast of this island (Ulleungdo). The islanders of this island (Ulleungdo) began to catch them since circa 1904. The catching period is 6 months from April to September. The engaging fish boats are three for now and they catch 5 sea lions in average for each of the fish boat. The abalones which Japanese catch are caught with 2 diving apparatuses and 2 steam ships, and they say that the average sum per day is 1,130-kin. There are no wild animals on the island, but scarcely wildcats and pigeons are visible. As to the wood available, there are lots of zelcova tree and pine tree.

    Exports and Imports
    The export includes soybean, zelcova wood, dried abalone, sea lion skin, sea lion oil, sea lion squeezed dregs and so on. The import includes polished rice, rice, sake (rice wine), shochu (clear distilled liquor), petroleum, sugar, cotton, cotton yarn, cotton fabrics, iron, ***, matches, ceramic ware, tableware, soy sauce, and somen (thin wheat noodles) etc. The total export from April to June 1905 was 12,075 yen and the total import was 3,116 yen.

    Provided things
    At every village, a few chickens and eggs are available at cheap price. Clear water is available at various places and they ssay its quality is good.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Gerry, I'm interested in the sea lion squeezed dregs in the export list. I remember that Nakai wrote in the plea that he invented the way how to process the sea lion bodies and discovered the remnant after squeezing oil would be useful as fertilizer.

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  6. Kaneganese,

    Please correct my translation. Especially I couldn't translate the words that I put *** instead.
    Thanks.

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  7. Gerry & pacifist,

    Great job!

    pacifist's translation was almost perfect, but those are the part I found it may be changed.

    Ulleungdo aka Matsushima (Dagelet island)
    All of these rocks are precipitous as well as the main island so that no caution won’t be needed to measure the depth of the water.

    Climate
    The land is very good for health, there has been no epidemic like smallpox. The aborigines(土人) say that it attributes to the good quality of water.
    ("土人" means Korean on the island, I guess. It looks like "韓人""土人" means Korean, and "邦人""島民""住民" means Japanese in this book. I am not sure if aborigines is a suitable word or not, but it clearly means Korean on the island, not Japanese residents.)

    Products
    The products of this island is soybean.
    (We should avoid to use "main island" to stop anymore sophistry such as Ulleundo and Takeshima are inseparable since Ulleundo was called as main island.)

    Exports and Imports
    straw bags(蓆叺), matches, ceramic ware, tableware, soy sauce, and somen (thin wheat noodles) etc.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Kaneganese, Gerry

    Thanks Kaneganese!

    It is difficult to translate 土人, as this word has been abolished because of its racial discriminative nature. There is a word 原住民 which is almost similar to 土人. According to dictionaries, 原住民 should be translated as a native, or an original inhabitant, or an aboligine. So Kaneganese's translation seems to be adequate.

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  9. Gerry, Kaneganese,

    I noticed that the original text used the word 土民, not 土人. 土民 may mean native residents or native people. By the way, the text also used 韓人ノ住民 (Korean residents).

    So, 邦人, 住民 (residents), 島民 (islanders) may mean Japanese and 土民 (native residents) or 韓人ノ住民 (Korean residents) may mean Korean people, am I right?

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  10. Pacifist,

    You are right, it says "土民", not "土人".

    By the way, I found a interesting article from JanJan(lefty Japanese internet media, similar to Oh my news. ). The reporter went to Ulleundo last year, and met old Japanese woman(82) who married to Korean. And another Korean lady who were born in 1931, says she really misses Japanese era and sang Japanese military song to him. 竹島を訪ねる旅(6)日本語を話す島の人 
    I also saw Japanese style house in somewhere.

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  11. Thank you Pacifist & Kaneganese. That is a very interesting translation, though there are some parts that are a little confusing for me. For example, it seems to be saying that Jukdo can be seem 2 and 3/4ths nautical ri to the "west-southwest" from the northeast coast of Ulleungdo, which is a mistake since it should be "east-southeast" from the northeast coast of Ulleungdo.

    By the way, that passage reminded me of a phrase in Korea's 1907 "Daehanjiji" (大韓地誌) that said, "Usando is southeast from there" (于山島는 其東南에 在하니라). Korean historians and Toadface claim that it is saying that Usando was southeast of Ulleungdo, but maybe what it was really saying that Usando was southeast of a point on Ulleungdo, such as the northeast shore. I am especially suspicion since Ulleungdo's Jukdo was not mentioned in the description of Ulleungdo in the 1907 "Daehanjiji." It is possible that the writer of Korea's 1907 Daehanjiji borrowed from Japan's "Joseon Waterways Directory"?

    I will try to add your translation to the post by tomorrow since I still have some things to do tonight. Take care.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Gerry,

    "For example, it seems to be saying that Jukdo can be seem 2 and 3/4ths nautical ri to the "west-southwest" from the northeast coast of Ulleungdo, "

    No, (sorry for my bad translation)the text referring to the two rocks (or rock islets), the first one is Jukdo (at offshore of northeast coast) and another one is a rock without a name (at about 2 and 3/4-ri sea miles south by southwest 1/4 west from the main island).

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  13. Pacifist,

    Are you sure it is not referring to Jukdo as "a rock" 2 and 3/4ths kilometers west-southwest? Except for Jukdo, I do not think there is another rock that far offshore of Ulleungdo.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Gerry,

    I re-read the original text:

    There is a rock of 2-shaku or 3-shaku depth under water at the northeast coast of the island where one can view Jukdo (Boussoule rock) at south by southwest 1/4 west at the distance about 2 and 3/4 sea miles.

    So it seems to refer to only one rock under the water, but I'm not sure if the author really wrote about a rock under the water. Was it 観音島 or 島項? (But from 観音島 Jukdo must be viewed at south by southeast...)

    ReplyDelete
  15. Pacifist,

    Maybe they are talking about the depth of the water around Jukdo?

    Do you think this translation is wrong?

    Jukdo (Boussole rock) is a rock that can be seen from the northeast shore about 2 and 3/4ths nautical ri to the west-southwest. At the edge of the rock, the water is two to three shaku deep.

    ReplyDelete
  16. I'm sorry, Pacifist. There is a rock west-southwest of Jukdo, so maybe the Japanese is correct. However, the rock I am referring to shows above the surface of the water. so I still do not know how to explain the part about the 2 and 3/4th shaku depth?

    ReplyDelete
  17. I think the sentence are referring to not Jukdo, but one rock 2-3 feet deep under the sea which is dangerous to ships. and it locates 2.75 sea miles to east plus 1.25 sea miles to north by northeast from Jukdo. So, if I am right, it means "There is a rock of 2-shaku or 3-shaku depth under water at the northeast coast of the island where one can view Jukdo (Boussoule rock) at south by southwest 1/4 seamile and at west 2 and 3/4 sea miles."

    ReplyDelete
  18. Kaneganese,

    Thanks, it can be so. The author may have forgotten to put "sea miles" after "south by southwest 1/4". It is reasonable!

    ReplyDelete
  19. Pacifist & Kaneganese,

    This is how "Matsusima or Dagalet" was describes in the 1873 China Sea Directory.

    MATU SIMA, or Dagelet island, is a collection of sharp conical hills, well clothed with wood, supporting an imposing peak in the centre, in lat. 37°30′N., long. 130°53′E. It is 18 miles in circumference, and in shape approximates a semicircle, the northern side, its diameter, running nearly E. by N. and W. by S. 6.25 miles. From each end the coast trends rather abruptly to the southward, curving gradually to the east and west, with several slight sinuosities until meeting at Seal Point, the south extreme of the island, off which is a small rock. There are several detached rocks along its shores, principally, however, on the north and east sides, some reaching an elevation of 400 to 500 feet. They are all, like the island, steep-to, and the lead affords no warning, but none of them are more than a quarter of a mile from the cliffs, except the Boussole rock, the largest, which is 7 cables from the east shore of the island. Hole rock on the north shore is remarkable, from having a large hole, or rather a natural archway through it, while nearly abreast it on the shore is a smooth but very steep sugar-loaf hill, apparently of bare granite, about 800 feet high. The sides of the island are so steep, that soundings could only be obtained by the Actaeon's boats, almost at the base of the cliffs, while in the ship at 4 miles to the southward no bottom could be found at 400 fathoms, and 2.25 miles north none at 366 fathoms. Landing may be effected in fine weather, with difficulty, on some small shingly beaches, which occur at intervals, but the greater part of the island is quite inaccessible.

    Doesn't it look like the first part of Pacifist's translation, or at least most of it, came from the above? Maybe we can just subtract and add the parts where needed?

    Pacifist,

    I could not see the map most of the day, either, but I can see it now.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Gerry,

    Kimotsuki wrote that he referenced British waterway journal (1884, Vol.49 for the chapter.

    Aren't there possibilities that the 1884 British journal was written on the basis of the 1873 China Sea Directory?

    ReplyDelete
  21. Pacifist,

    In regard to Ulleungdo, there was probably not much difference between the two editions. Anyway, please look at my edits for Ulleungdo and tell me if they match up pretty well with the Japanese.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Gerry,

    Thanks, it looks good.
    BTW, please add "straw bags" at the point of *** in the "Exports and Imports".
    Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  23. Gerry,

    I've just noticed that first picture which include p3-4 with Kimotsuki's preface dating 1st Jan, 1892 are not from Joseon Seaways Directory in 1907, but from Japan Seaways Directory, it may be published in 1892. And it does says that 海軍大佐 肝付兼行(Admiral Kimotsuki), so it looks like he was an Admiral in 1892 after all.

    ReplyDelete
  24. Hi Kaneganese,

    I think 海軍大佐 is a captain. Admiral is 海軍大将.

    toadface always say Admiral Kimotsuki to put emphasis that top of the navy (admiral) made Nakai make the plea, but it was not true.

    For details, please look at this:
    http://dic.yahoo.co.jp/docs/sub/hyo1.html

    ReplyDelete
  25. Thank you, pacifist!

    Yes, you are right. It says captin, not Admiral. As far as we know, he didn't go beyond Vice Admiral(海軍中将).

    By the way, I checked half-moon's pdf, and it does include the second page from other directory. Do you think he did it on purpose? Well, anyway, I learned that we have to be careful when we use his documents.

    ReplyDelete
  26. Thanks for pointing out that odd page, Kaneganese. I hadn't noticed it because it seemed to fit in pretty well. Anyway, I removed that page.

    ReplyDelete
  27. not anonymous18/10/07 14:18

    Pacifist, I'm not even sure the Navy's hydrographic department would even have a ranking of "admiral". I think the title given to the head of the Hydrographic Department was "Director". Kimotsuki along with Political Affairs Bureau Director Yamaza Enjiro we responsible for Liancourts annexation. Yamaza Enjiro said the incorporation was urgent particularly under the present situation, and it is absolutely necessary and advisable to construct watchtowers and install wireless or submarine cable and keep watch on the hostile warships.

    Pacifist the Japanese myth that the Koreans were not able to sail to Dokdo is simply Japanese Takeshima lobbyist propaganda.

    The first Europeans to discover Ulleungdo (Dagelet)La Perouse in 1787 reported Korean carpenters were building boats on Ulleungdo in two different locations. These boats were described as Chinese form (junks) which were sailing vessels, not rafts as some have stated here.

    In 1864 The China Pilot records the Koreans building junks (Chinese style sailboats) on Ulleungdo and also collecting shellfish (abalone)

    The 1870 records of Dagelet by naturalist Arthur Adams records Koreans again building boats, collecting abalone and drying seal meat they had harvested.

    Korean fishermen on Ulleungdo

    Lee Gyuwon's diary reports about 100 Koreans involved in boatmaking on Ulleungdo on all sides of the island. They had travelled around 550 kms every year from Chodo Island, Geomundo and Nakan on Korea's south coast. In his report to King Gojong he said the three main activities were boat-building, seaweed collecting and abalone fishing.

    Here is a picture of Korean fishermen taken at Port Hamiliton (Geomundo-Samdo) in 1875 for a British publication The Graphic.

    Korean fishermen

    The Koreans who did these activities were very adept at sailing. Although their boats were often described as inferior to Japanese and Chinese if they could sail 550 kms to Ulleungdo, going another 87km would be like a walk in the park.

    Here is an image of a Korean fishing boat in 1871. You can see this boat was capable of making an ocean voyage.

    Korean fishing boat

    In 1880 author Oppert described Korean fishing boats as of rude construction. However we know they were up to the task of going to Ulleungdo, no problem. On top of that, they routinely carried crews of 30~40 men and sometimes up to 60 people.

    Korean Boats 1

    Korean Boats 2

    Korean Boats 3

    So you see Pacifist, the Japanese Takeshima propaganda machine has misled you. Koreans of the 18th~19th Centuries easily had the ability to sail to Dokdo. The vast majority of korean, Ulleungdo residents were NOT just agriculturalists but also transient islanders who harvested abalone, seals, and seeweed. They were also boat (船) not raft (筏) builders and thus not landlocked farmers.

    ReplyDelete
  28. Steve
    Where is the evidence Koreans sailed to Dokdo.? You only proved Koreans built a ship on Ulleungdo.
    If even adept fishermen had not found out where Dokdo is, that would make Korean situation desperate.
    But there is a good reason for that:Koreans had been banned visiting even Ulleungdo by Korean Government.


    Gerry, Pacifist, Kaneganese.
    Keep up a good job. Superb works!!

    ReplyDelete
  29. Thank you, Ponta. It is good to hear from you, again. I have not seen you post much lately. I was wondering what happened to you.

    By the way, it seems that some "Dokdo" lovers have found our site. The survey vote for Dokdo has suddenly jumped from 4 votes to 20 in just one day.

    ReplyDelete
  30. Hi! Ponta.
    Thank you for the compliment. We are enjoying intellectual debate and getting more and more new findings. And the good part is, we can see more things when we collaborate. You know, "三人寄れば文殊の知恵(Two heads are better than one.)". I hope you can join us more frequently. And myCoree, too.

    In the preface of , as a director, Kimotsuki himself clearly state that he knew about the Chapter I, "General". In that chapter, the eastern limit of Choson was defined as 130°35′, which exclude Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks. Since, in the same book, Liancourt Rocks were defined its location as 131°55′, Thus, we literally succeeded to debunk the illogical propaganda assumptions made and spread by Professor Emeritus Naitou who says Kimotsuki knew Takeshima was Korean territory, And prove that Kimotsuki advised Nakai to apply to incorporate Liancourt Rocks into Japanese since he clearly knew that the island was outside Korean territory and even British Navy knew this as a fact. British Navy, Japanese Navy and Korean Imperial Ministry of Education printed eastern limit of Choson, which exclude Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks on their official publications.

    By the way, this 1894 「朝鮮水路誌」(Choson Sea Directory) is an very important book for us since it proves many things pro-Korean claims are wrong.
    1. Preface: Kimotsuki Kaneyuki, the director of hydrographic department wrote that "General" part of Chapter I is cited from British Navy's China Sea directory.
    2. Chapter I : In General, it clearly stated that eastern limit of Choson is 130°35′, which excludes Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks.
    3. Chapter III : there is an article of "The Eastern Channel" between the south point of Tsushima and Iki island which is Japanese territory. It proves that the Choson Sea Directories were not published for territorial purpose, but for the safety of Sea-lanes.
    4. Chapter IV : Liancourt Rocks comes before Ulleundo. It proves that both British and Japanese Navy did not consider Liancourt Rocks as an appendix to Ulleundo.
    5. Chapter IV : The location of Liancourt Rocks is clearly stated as 131°55′, It proves that Kimotsuki clearly knew this island was outside Korean territory.
    6. Chapter IV : Jukdo, not Liancourt Rocks was mentioned as a neighboring island of Ulleundo.
    7. Chapter IV : There is an article of Wyoda Rocks, which is supposed to locate in Russian territory. It also proves that the Choson Sea Directories were not published for territorial purpose, but for the safety of Sea-lanes.


    Technically, I think it was possible for mainland Korean to just sail to Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks in the early 20C even with their traditional boats, or Junks, but the point is, it was not probable for Korean to fish without Japanese modern knowledge and equipments and there is no single record to support their solo activity on Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks. And there are no Korean islanders on Ulleundo in those days that own "boat" to go outer sea. In Professor Emeritus Natious's book, one Zainichi Korean lady reports that there were nothing else but only tiny raft shown in Dokdo Museum, and even for a Pro-Korean like her, it was really hard to imagine that Korean islanders 100 years ago used this raft and sailed to Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks.

    Ulleundo was much more lucrative in marine products (seaweeds and abalones), lumber, ginseng, and so on. Moreover, those are much easier to gather or collect. Ulleundo had a place to stay, woods to burn so that they can cook, water to drink and so on. Practically, it was not economical for Korean fishermen to go to fishing Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks as a solo destination. For Korean fishermen from mainland, Ulleundo was cost effective place to go, but not Takeshima. That was exactly the main reason that The Oyas and The Murakawas in Edo era mainly used Matsushima (today's Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks) as a relay point between Oki and Ulleundo. Ulleundo was too lucrative compared to tiny Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks, thus economically effective (though there are some records that later, The Murakawas started to develop Matsushima as a solo destination for their fishing and trade, and The Oyas also tried to join in. And some cargo ships used Matsushima as a landmark when they sail from western Japan to Northern Japan.). Besides, sailing across the Sea of Japan was very dangerous. In fact, there are many records that even The Murakawas and The Oyas ships were casted away several times. Not to mention of Korean in Choson era. But when Meiji Reform began and Japanese fishermen started fishing and hunting sea lions with modern powerful ships with proper apparatus and equipments on Takeshima, the importance of this tiny island was rediscovered by Japanese in Meiji.

    I'm reading some books on history of diving people in Japan and Korea. The more I learn about fishermen and diving women in Choson era, the more I become convinced that it is almost impossible for Korean in the very early 20c was fishing around Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks which is almost 250km away from mainland when there is an much more lucrative island as Ulleundo before it. I think Koreans are clever enough to avoid economical risks and choose not to go further economically lucrative Ulleundo.

    Gerry wrote,
    "it seems that some "Dokdo" lovers have found our site. The survey vote for Dokdo has suddenly jumped from 4 votes to 20 in just one day."
    I hope they read some of our posts or comment, at least. It is really interesting to see how pro-Korean reacts. I also hope we are not going to suffer from famous f5-attacks by VANKers. (・_・;)

    ReplyDelete
  31. Sorry for the above comment. It looked fine when I previewed. Weird.

    Anyway, Url for 1894 朝鮮水路誌is
    .

    ReplyDelete
  32. ???
    For anyone who are interested in 1894 朝鮮水路誌(Choson Sea Directory), go to toron's site first, and click URL.

    ReplyDelete
  33. not anonymous18/10/07 21:59

    Ponta I posted the information to point out some critical flaws in Japanese Takeshima lobbyists position on this dispute. There have been some misconceptions bantered about on this forum and they should be corrected.

    Koreans lacking clear records on Dokdo are more a sign of the disparity in development between Korea and Japan in the 18th and 19th Centuries. Even without these records how much sense does it make to say Koreans weren't cognizant of Dokdo or lacked the ability to sail there when they arrived from 550kms away every spring?

    On top of that we know those who did this journey from Chodo, Geomundo and Nakan were essentially involved in gathering marine products on Ulleungdo. As shown by the 1870 document by naturalist Arthur Adams the Koreans were gathering abolone and even sealing on around Ulleungdo around the mid 19th Century. Leegyuwon counted no less than 98 people building boats on Ulleungdo in 1882. He also mentioned they were building huts or tents. Those people from Chollanamdo were transient fishermen who would have relied on fishing for sustenance not agriculture.

    Even in the case of Ulleungdo Island itself Chosun lagged way behind even the Europeans in regard to clear records of these islands and it's not surprising when you read some accounts of the poor "surveys" the dispatched inspectors did when they came to "inspect" the island.

    Ponta.
    I think the early Chosun government was out of touch with the residents of Ulleungdo. These inspectors knew Koreans were living there but turned a blind eye to them and rarely followed up on the vacant island policy. I also think those who resided and annually voyaged to Ulleungdo were well aware of Dokdo and visited the island often. It's hard to imagine these people voyaging to Ulleungdo for at least 100 years, annually building boats, fishing around the island and not being cognizant of an island within visual proximity. Don't you think?

    Anyway here a document describing the true nature of Chosun's policy on Koreans living on Ulleungdo during the vacant island policy era. This was pre-settlement era (1880) You can see the Korean government didn't really follow up on rounding up and punishing those who lived on Ulleungdo.

    Vacant Island Policy

    Vacant Island Policy

    ReplyDelete
  34. toadface,

    In the "Waterways magazine" that Gerry introduced in another posting, the author mentions boat building in Ulleungdo:

    我輩の此に到るや土人の小舎を構へ漁舟を造るを見たり。
    When I reached this, I saw aboligenes set a hut and make a fish boat.

    toadface, boats they were making were only small boats to fish abalone and seaweeds around Ulleungdo, not those big ships for navigation offshore.
    Those big ships may have been made in mainland of Korean peninsula but not in Ulleungdo.

    BTW, ponta, how nice to hear from you!
    Please write as frequently as you can.

    ReplyDelete
  35. Korean extreme nationalist believe that Japanese don't wrote about korean boat builder???

    There are many discription about that.
    ⅰ1883.00.00 『水路雑誌』
    周囲は絶壁多く唯南東面に少しく平坦なる処あり。我輩の此に到るや土人の小舎を構へ漁舟を造るを見たり。他の浜岸は小舟と雖も近つく可らさるか如し。

    ⅱ1886.12.00『寰瀛水路誌 第二巻第二版 韓露沿岸』
    春夏の季節に於いては朝鮮人此島に渡来し朝鮮形船を製造し以て之を其本地に送りまた多量の介蟲を収集乾晒す蓋し朝鮮人の船を製造するや鉄金丑を知らずして必ず生木を用ゆるもの、如し


    It is interesting that the discription no.ⅱ is very same with the photo that TOADFACE posted, the boat is really similar Chinese Junk, still shown in Southeast of China and Vietnam today as well.Japan's record has much details,it is awsome!

    ReplyDelete
  36. Steve wrote:
    Ponta.
    I think the early Chosun government was out of touch with the residents of Ulleungdo.


    Toadface, that is crucial. So there is no official record on Dokdo.That shows Korean govenment had no effective control over Dokdo.
    Thank you .

    Gerry, Pacifist, Kaneganese.
    Thank you guys for warm welcome.

    Yes, I've noticed the poll has changed in a few days.
    This site has been a quite and serious site. I hope it will maintain the trait.

    ReplyDelete
  37. See the two photo ,one photo and another in the book.

    The photo ,"Korean fishing boat"in 1871,ship has rectangular-shape sail to get more power for long distance navigation.

    But the photo in the book "Korean boat 1-3", the boat has triangle-shape sail,to get control and it means short and no raugh water purpose.

    Still there was no record that Korean sails Liancourt Rocks from Ullungdo before 1901...No report by korean including 李奎遠 and 禹用鼎.

    ReplyDelete
  38. GTOMR,
    I forgot to mention about you. You are also very welcome to comment on this site. We need more logical person from both side. By the way, could you give me an e-mail? The address is my ID atmark mail.goo.ne.jp

    Toadface wrote;
    "Pacifist the Japanese myth that the Koreans were not able to sail to Dokdo is simply Japanese Takeshima lobbyist propaganda."

    As I keep telling you and pacifist and GTOMR pointed out above, nobody is denying Korean were building boats on Ulleundo and sailing between mainland even before 20c. But the fact that Korean were building Junks doesn't mean they were risking their lives and economical bankrupcy for a dangerous and poorer marine products on Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks at all. Japanese official trade documents clearly described that there were absolutly no Korean fishermen except for some who just collect seaweeds etc on the shore and seasonal fishermen from mainland who had no space for islanders to bring them back to mainland since they were fully loaded with seaweeds o Ulleundo. The point is, going further than Ullendo was not economically effective for Korean who were mainly engaged in farming and had enough yields already and much lucrative Ulleundo 92km shorter on their side, but it was cost effective or worth as a risk headge for a Japanese, who had Takeshima on their side and more lucrative Ulluendo ahead. Thus it was very natural and important for Japanese fishermen with a official licence to go to Takeshima(todays Ulleundo) in Edo and Meiji and had an effective control over Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks as a relay base and additional marine products supplyers. And it was not that risky for Meiji Japanese fishermen who has modernized fishery boats(漁船改良丸)and equipment to come and go to Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks, unlike Korean fishemen who were only building traditional Junks before Japanese taught modern fishing methods. Besides, as ponta pointed out, even going to Ulleundo was stricktly forbidden before 1983, why do they risk going further for nothing ? Anyway, there is absolutely no concrete evidence that Korean fishermen were going to Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks, on the contraty, there are thousands of clear evidence Japanese had known and owned the Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks from 1600's. Even in 1906, 沈, Korean official on Ulleundo didn't even know where so-called "Dokdo" was.

    ReplyDelete
  39. not anonymous19/10/07 13:27

    Kanganese, I came here and posted the information to keep the posters on this forum from making incorrect and absurd claims about the Koreans on Ulleungdo. Pacifist stated Koreans on Ulleungdo were only farmers and this is far from the truth.

    I'm not trying to make claim that these are clear proof of Korean activity on Liancourt Rocks. What I'm saying is at sea level Dokdo island is within visual distance about 2~3 hours from Ulleungdo. Dokdo is also visible from Ulleungdo. With Koreans building boats on Ulleungdo, sealing, and fishing the waters around the island for at least 120 years before 1900 the only logical conclusion is that they were at least cognizant of Dokdo long before early 20th Century.

    Kanganese, Shim Heung Taek stated "Dokdo part of Uldo County" was claimed by Japanese. Any normal person would agree this is clear proof that Koreans considered Liancourt Rocks part of their territory. But no, Takeshima lobbyists have to scour the document for inconsistencies to discredit it. This is shabby. Shim Heung Taek was not a surveyor and although his distance was inaccurate, we know he was being sincere when he corresponded with the central government. The name Dokdo was in use before the Japanese annexed the island so there is no doubt as to the identity of the island in question.

    Again Kanganese, whatever records exist by Japan prior to 1905 they either show Japan did not consider Liancourt Rocks part of Japan or show they thought the islands were Chosun land. Where are these records that Japan owned Dokdo before 1905?

    In today's modern world there is no reason for Japan to own Takeshima. Extending Japan's territory an additional 160kms to within visual proximity of land deemed a part of Korea from the 6th Century?? That simply isn't going to happen and it is a totally unacceptable position Japan has taken. Especially when you consider Japan's only claim to Dokdo is a military annexation undertaken during the height of her expansionist era.

    ReplyDelete
  40. Toadface wrote;
    "I'm not trying to make claim that these are clear proof of Korean activity on Liancourt Rocks. "

    I can't agree more. When you find it, please let us know. It is really good to see you finally admit that Korean has absolutely no legal right to claim Japanese Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks as their territory. I hope Korean would stop illegal occupation over Takeshima/Liancourt Rocks immediately, and at least go to ICJ.

    Toadface, stop manipulating Korean people into what you want them to be. They are old enough to decide on their own. You are making Korean look really stupid and bad.

    ReplyDelete
  41. anonymous wrotewhy don't you guys try to find some Korean documents?

    That is what people are trying hard to do,but they can't;because there isn't any.


    hey wrote:
    if japanese didn't admit that it was korean property, they wouldn't even let koreans step on Dokdo. you know japanese, they were the ones who raped korean moms and made them suck their dirty monkey balls in world war 2.
    People should realise this is the typical way people who support Korean claim.

    ReplyDelete
  42. By the way, this site was added to the list of the links on the Web Takeshima Research Centre today !!

    ReplyDelete
  43. Wow, Kaneganese, that is good news. I guess that means we are somewhat famous. Now I feel even more pressure to polish up the blog.

    ReplyDelete
  44. Gerry wrote;
    "The survey vote for Dokdo has suddenly jumped from 4 votes to 20 in just one day."

    17th Oct. →  4
    18th Oct. →  20
    19th Oct. →  40
    20th Oct. → 102

    What the...? Can we analyze those votes?
    Anyway, it looks like "voting" is a good bait to let pro-Korean people to visit this site. It was a good idea. I think I'm going to vote once a day for a while so that it looks like numbers are competing. (^_-)

    ReplyDelete
  45. Kaneganese,

    Yes, the voting suggests that we are being VANKed, but that does not bother me. I have only voted once and do not intend to vote, again, even though I have another computer at my office. I will simply let the content of the blog speak for itself.

    ReplyDelete
  46. Gerry,

    I think you can feel free to change your opinion and vote for the other even if you had once voted. I will do so if I find more convincing and concrete evidence by Korean side. And I don't intend to vote in order to compete with pro-Korean people, but to try to maintain a balance.(Actually, funny thing is, votes for Japan is also getting, not "jumped", but increased. ) What I meant was, it's good that this blog is getting VANKed and as a result, get much attention from Korean or others and give Korean people more chance and opportunity to know that there are many opinion outside Korea. Though I'm not sure if it's good for you or not...

    ReplyDelete
  47. non-annomymous wrote 10:18 PM
    >In 1880 author Oppert described Korean fishing boats as of rude construction. However we know they were up to the task of going to Ulleungdo, no problem. On top of that, they routinely carried crews of 30~40 men and sometimes up to 60 people.

    Ernst Oppert wrote that Korean fishing boat is similar with Japanese fishing boat rather than Chinese one.why you intentionally delete this discription???

    And La Perouse saw "Shambang舢板 boat" or "junk" nearby southern coast of Korea after Quelipert(JEJU).

    Anyway those above are not raft.But Ullungdo people mainly pick up abalone or seaweed using raft筏,many japanese records shows it and even korean records admit main product is seaweed and abalone from the sea and timber and agricultural crops from the land..It is the way to pick them that hey pick it with buddy. One pick up seaweed or abalone while the other waition on the raft to contol it.
    Timber,especially 桐 is famous for Ullegundo.On On Ullungdo 桐 grows double spped(I think it is exaggarate expression)because of fertile land so they can got good one.Korean built boats to sell it in mainland, Japanese cut it for boat,wooden slipper and so on.

    ReplyDelete
  48. I agree, Kaneganese. The more who know about the blog, the better.

    ReplyDelete
  49. not anonymous21/10/07 00:35

    Gtmor, you are wrong. La Perouse saw the Koreans on Ulleungdo (Dagelet) Here is a translation of his entry for May 28th 1787.

    "...May 27th I gave the signal that we arrived on the East Sea. After a short while, to the North~Northeast an island was observed that was not on any charts. This island seemed to be 20 leagues (actual 137kms) away from the Chosun coast. I tried to approach the island but it was difficult because the island was is the same direction as the winds. Fortunately, during the night the direction of the wind had changed. (May 28th) By dawn we left toward the island for measurements and I decided to name this island Dagelet after the astronomer Lapaute Dagelet among our crew who sighted it first. The circumference of the island is only three leagues (actual 33kms) Maintaining a distance of 1.9kms from the island we travelled almost all around but failed to find deep water. Therefore I decided to lower a small boat into the water and left Boutin in command to check the depths of water en route to land. He soon found that the depth of this place was 140 meters and it was about 200 meters from the island. The Northeast point of the island is 37° 25' North latitude and the 129° 2' East longitude. Even though the island is made of sheer cliffs, from the top to the shore it is covered with very beautiful trees. Other that seven little inlets for mooring the island is surrounded by precipitous cliffs. In this little inlet we observed some boats of Chinese style being built. It appeared that those boat builders were startled by our ship maybe because they were within the range of our cannons. They fled into the woods about 50 paces from their workplace. However, what we saw was a few huts, with no village or crops. It appeared that some Chosun carpenters from the mainland which is only 110 kms from Dagelet come with provisions and build boats during the summer before they take them to the mainland for sale. I'm sure this assumption is correct. When we returned to the West point of the island we again observed other workers building boats but they didn't see us approach because a point of land blocked their view. Those people by a tree stump looked frightened to see us except for a couple of them who didn't seemed to be afraid of us, they all ran into the woods. I thought we needed to persuade them that we are good people and are not their enemy so I looked for a place to drop anchor. Unfortunately the strong currents pushed us away from the island. Night approached. Due to our concerns that we might again be pushed from the island, and fears of not being able to retrieve the dispatched boat under Boutin's command I signalled to M. Boutin, who was about to land, and ordered him to return. I ordered the Astrolobe which was far to the West due to currents, to approach Mr Boutin's group. Luckily the high peaks of Dagelet blocked the winds and spend the night peacefully...."

    Here is the map La Perouse drew.

    La Perouse Map

    This was translated from his diary which was of course in French first. Didn't you read the document I gave you from Arthur Adams?

    Adams quoted "...As we landed in a little bay, we perceived three poor Koreans at work. We observed that they were engaged with adze (an axe-like carpenter's tool) and saw in repairing a dilapidated boat exactly as La Perouse found those he saw eighty years ago. They had dried vast numbers of haliotis or sea ears (abalone) which they string on rattans for the Chinese market which they sell at a rate of three hundred for a dollar. They likewise collect great heaps of dried seals' flesh...The Korean fishermen dry large quantities of petrels, leaving their skins in mouldering heaps along the shore..."

    Adams document

    Gtmor, the boats are described as Chinese stlye and "junks" by La Perouse and the China Sea Directory, do you know what a junk is? A junk is a flat bottomed Chinese sailboat. You don't use a sailboat to gather seaweed near shore. Both Laperouse and the China sea directory said the boats were taken to the mainland. Taking a very light boat onto the heavy seas for 550 kms would be crazy.

    I agree about the boats. Leegyuwon described those who built these boats as "boat merchants" But from all the records above, these Koreans also gathered seaweed, fished for abalone and even were seal hunters in the late 19th Century.
    Because these people were not agriculturalists they survived on marine products to live. So that being said, Korean activities on Ulleungdo didn't really differ much from that of the Japanese at that time.

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  50. toadface,

    I have just read the translated version of the "Korea And Her Nighbours" (A Narrative of Travel, with an Account of the Vicissitudes and Position of the Country) by Mrs. Bishop (Isabella Bird). It was published in London originally in 1905. Isabella travelled Chosun four times in 3 years from January 1894 to March 1897. (So she travelled Chosun during and after the war of Japan with Qing and puiblished it just the same year as the Russo-Japanese war.)

    There are some interesting depictions in the chapter 12. To follow is my translation into English (although the original text was written in English).
    I hope some of you may help me and let me know the original texts.

    "The fact that more than 8,000 Japanese fishermen are living on coastal fishery around Busan shows that there are quite a lot of catch. It is said that Korean fishermen lack in enthusiasm. Mr. Oisen blamed on Korean fishermen in a custom report concerning 元山 in 1891 saying, "they are satisfied with a small catch that can be achieved by setting a primitive trap at coast and watching it for an hour or so". However, I must say that every village I happened to pass by had 7 to 11 fishing boats and they go to sea. These boats are not suitable for navigation, it is no wonder they don't go far from coast. "

    "Korean junks are not so large so that they can't navigate. It is no wonder a boatman don't make his junk be apart from the shore and will search for a shelter when the wind will blow that may seem to be good for navigation. Korean junks are built without nails and metal fittings, but it seems that these stopgap timbers and boards were happen to fit rather than assembled after considering. Two tall and heavy masts fixed with an edge between the timbers in the bottom of the boats are easy to fall so that we have to watch them all the time. Sails are strawmats which are put on horizontally laid bamboos and are bound by a rope. The sail can be manipulated by the rope, or I should say that it is to be manipulated by the rope. In reality, they sail with a slow fair wind but whenever the wind goes high they put the bamboos and strawmats down, they put them down not caring about the matter they loaded beneath them. The manipulation is done by pulling the rope, using pins that were placed at the stern and two points at the beam that were protruded on both sides of the boat for 3 feet each. Junks have very large rudders, which also work as balance boards. The price of a junk is $60 to $80. They can sail on fair wind but it is apt to be impossible to pilot the boat if it is not on fair wind."

    toadface, as Mrs Bird wrote, Korean people in those days can't navigate or sail on the open sea, while Japan had modern steam ships and had regular services around Japan Sea including liners to Chosun, China and Russia.

    And toadface, the book clearly wrote the territory of Chosun in those years (1894-1897); it says it was the north latitude 34°17' to 43°, east longitude 124°38' to 130°33'. And this shows that it didn't include Liancourt rocks.

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  51. not anonymous21/10/07 23:44

    Pacifist, whatever Mr Bird said is wrong.

    It is a historical fact that Koreans sailed annually to Ulleungdo from Samdo, Chodo and Nakan. Lee Gyuwon's diary records that. The China Sea directory records it as well. La Perouse recorded Koreans building boats on Ulleungdo on 1787 and even Anyongbok sailed all the way to Japan. So what is your point?

    So we know the Koreans were sailing over 500 kms annually on open sea Pacifist. Don't mislead readers from historical fact by a misinformed writer. All you are doing is proving how incompetent a writer Mrs Bird was. You should cite first-hand accounts of Ulleungdo Island.

    Mrs Bird also forgot to include Ulleungdo Island in her definition of Korea. Ulleungdo is at about 130.55.

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  52. Non-Anonymous (Steve Barber),

    The 1873 edition of the "China Sea Directory," which was a British publication, confirms some of what Ms. Bishop wrote. Here is what was written in the directory:

    During the spring and summer months some Koreans reside on the island, and build junks which they take across to the mainland; they also collect and dry large quantities of shell-fish. Except a few iron clamps, their boats are all wood-fastened, and they do not appear to appreciate the value of seasoned timber, as they invariably use quite green wood.

    Steve, you need to accept the fact that Koreans in the Joseon dynasty were not really a seafaring people. Ulleungdo could be seen from the Korean mainland, so it was a point-and-go trip, but there are no records that Koreans traveled past Ulleungdo, unless they happened to get caught in a storm and drift to Japan, as An Yong-bok did.

    Korean records show that Koreans considered the trip to Ulleungdo to be very dangerous, which was one of the main reasons the island was not developed sooner. Even the Ulleungdo inspectors were afraid to go, and provincial governors often made excuses for not sending them.

    By the way, for those who might be interested, the video I linked to in my last post shows examples of the small, 1-man rafts that Korean fishermen used to navigate the shores around Ulleungdo, and they did not look very safe.

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  53. toadface,

    Even if you don't admit, Mrs Isabella Bird (Bishop) was a famous travelling journalist in those days.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isabella_Bird

    Her books are well-considered and accurate. I think the Korean territory she wrote in the book may be based on the information from UK as her journeys were backed up by the British ambassador (who wrote the preface)and people of British embassy.

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  54. toadface,

    Her book in English is available from amazon:

    http://www.amazon.com/Korea-Neighbors-Kegan-Paul-Travellers/dp/0710308124

    Reviews on the above site are favouable including Korean readers.

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  55. dokdo-takeshima.com23/10/07 00:02

    Gerry, I agree that by and large Koreans were not a seafaring people. However there is an exception to this rule and that would be those who halied from the South Cholla provinces.

    What I'm only interested in is the Koreans relationship with the island of Ulleungdo and the vicinity you can post all other irrelevant data you want but it isn't helping you one iota Gerry et al.

    Whatever self-serving generalizations you and your lobbyists may make Gerry they are clearly shown as wrong by Western, Korean and Japanese documents that show Koreans were voyaging to Ulleungdo 550 kms every year, building boats, collecting shellfish, and sealing the waters around Ulleungdo. Watching your crew scramble for contrary documents is pretty funny acturally.

    It was Pacifist that put his foot in his mouth by trying to say the Koreans on Ulleungdo were farmers. Wrong wrong wrong....

    Gerry, stop misleading the readers. Yes, the Koreans used rafts to collect seaweed etc around rocks. What the documents above say is "Koreans built boats "船" NOT rafts "筏" and took them back to the Korean mainland.

    First Chinese characters distinguish between rafts and boats Gerry. The records of Lee Gyu Won say they were building boats "船". Other Western records refer to these boats as "junks" or Chinese style SAILBOATS no rafts.

    In 1902 the Situation on Ulleungdo recorded at least 20 boats travelling all the way to Geomundo Island from Ulleungdo and you say the Koreans couldn't make the journey? Get real.

    Here is how far the Koreans travelled every year to Ulleungdo. It must have taken the better part of a week for the Koreans to sail this far. But we know they did it, and I'll bet they did it since at least the 18th Century.

    Korean Annual Travel Route to Ullengdo

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  56. Dokdo-Takeshima.com (Steve),

    Even the people from Jolla Province were not really seafaring people. Didn't you read the quote from the British publication? The Koreans were building boats with green wood and wooden fasteners.

    Also, look at your own route map for their ships. It shows they hugged the coastline until they got parallel with Ulleungdo, which could been seen from the mountains on the Korean coast, and then they pointed their ship, as straight as they could, and hoped for the best. When they lost sight of the Korean coast, they had to start looking for the mountains of Ulleungdo. If they couldn't find them, they were screwed.

    Finally, they sailed to Ulleungdo, not to Liancourt Rocks, which is the whole point of this discussion, isn't it? Even your silly route map shows that the people from Jolla Province stopped at Ulleungdo.

    You have no maps or documents to support your claim that Koreans surely went to Liancourt Rocks before the Japanese took them there in the early 1900s. Instead, you hope that people believe your "common sense" argument, which according to your Web site, is as follows:

    Common sense tells us Koreans who had lived within visual proximity of Dokdo for a thousand years before the Japanese arrival on Ulleungdo (link) must have been cognizant of Dokdo Island. As the above maps and records show Koreans had the ability to sail two days to Ulleungdo from the Korean mainland at will. To think these people who relied on marine products to survive couldn't or didn't travel the extra few hours East of Ulleungdo to see Dokdo simply doesn't make sense.

    Your common sense is different from my common sense because my common sense tells me that if Korea does not have, even after that thousand year period you talked about, even one map or document showing that Koreans traveled to Liancourt Rocks, then that means they did not travel there.

    The conversation between King Kojong and Ulleungdo inspector Lee Gyu-won in 1882 and Lee's subsequent report of his inspection give no hint that Koreans knew about Liancourt Rocks, and show very clearly that even if Koreans did know about Liancourt Rocks, they did not consider them a part of Ulleungdo.

    To make a legal claim for Liancourt Rocks, Koreans need documents and maps for proof, not Steve-Barber common sense.

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