I do not support the Korean movement to rename the "Sea of Japan" to the "East Sea," just as I would not support a movement to rename the "Gulf of Mexico" or any other standardized geographic name. Why make geography more confusing than it already is?
I see Korea's "East Sea" movement as a nationalistic, anti-Japanese movement. If it were not anti-Japanese, then Koreans would be pushing equally as hard to change the name "Yellow Sea" to the "West Sea."
Koreans may not realize it, but their campaign to change the name of the Sea of Japan looks pretty silly to the rest of the world, and I would advise them to stop it.I may reconsider my stance when I start seeing a majority of Korea's Web sites and maps using the name "Sea of Japan" alongside the name "East Sea."
5.2.10
I do not support Korea's "East Sea" movement.
Today, I got an E-mail from someone asking me to include the name "East Sea" next to "Sea of Japan" in my "Purpose of this Blog" introduction. I refused by responding as follows:
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this is not the geographical matter. japanese trying to taking over dokdo island for the sake of 'fishing more broadly under the protection of international low'. also it is about the history, legacy, and the heritage not about naming easily or so. they already did changed yollow sea - west sea through out all the books in schools.
ReplyDeleteGerry Bevers the American who is famous for bashing all things Koreran, doesn’t support the ROK on the East Sea, Sea of Japan?
ReplyDeleteSay it ain’t so!!!! Lol
Korea owns about half of this body of water and has every right to insist upon a name that reflects the current relationship between Japan and Korea. This sea is part of Korea too after all.
The name Sea of Japan is a legacy of past western influence in northeast Asia. In reality this body of water was also called East Sea, Sea of Corea, and Sea of Japan by western nations, Korea and Japan.
You can see many maps showing Chosun Sea or Sea of Korea at this page.
SeaofKorea
East Sea? I dunno, but Sea of Japan? No way, its simply not Japan’s sea. Why is Japan fighting this so much anyway
BTW, if America doesn’t like the name Gulf of Mexico, they too should insist the part of this body of water that is American be named otherwise. No nation has the right to impose a name on any geographical feature that is part of another’s territory. Korea and Japan should work on a new name.
Truth-of-Dokdo
Yes, Gerrybevers,
ReplyDeleteWe know those textbook so no need to support Korean claim.
http://sites.google.com/site/japanseamerdujapon/Home/korean-use-the-name-of-sea-of-japan-i
Tae Jay & Steve,
ReplyDeleteThe name "Sea of Japan" does not mean the sea belongs to Japan, just as the name "Indian Ocean" does not mean that ocean belongs to India. It is just name, and it neither helps nor hurts Japan's claims to Takeshima (Dokdo).
Steve wrote:
No nation has the right to impose a name on any geographical feature that is part of another’s territory.
Really? Then why is Korea trying to impose the name "East Sea" on the rest of us? The Sea of Japan belongs to no one country, and even if it all did belong to Korea, she would still have no right to impose her name for the sea on the rest of the world.
Korea can refer to the sea by any name she wants, just as Japan and the rest of the world can refer to the sea by any name they want. For example, China and Vietnam refer to the "East China Sea" simply as the "East Sea," while the rest of the world refers to it as the East China Sea. That is probably why both China and Vietnam refer to the Sea of Japan as "Sea of Japan."
GTOMR,
I do not support Korea's campaign to change the name of the Sea of Japan because it is nothing but an example of Koreans being petty, anti-Japanese nationalists.
Koreans need to stop trying to spread hatred of Japan because their anti-Japanese antics are hurting Korea more then they are hurting Japan.
Korea is imposing a name on us? Mr Bevers, you are off of the mark.
ReplyDeleteKorea is not imposing a name on other people. She is trying to get the world and Japan to adopt a name for a geographical feature within the limits of her own territory. After all, considering both North and South Korea's EEZs the Koreas own about half of this body of water.
The links I showed you above prove a point. There is a historical basis for Korea's assertions that "Sea of Japan" was not the only name the East Sea was referred to by the world before the colonial era. Historically speaking The "Sea of Japan" was also frequently, if not equally called Sea of Chosun and Sea of Corea.
That said, if Japan is such an open modern nation why are they lobbying tooth and nail to oppose the changing of the name? What are Japan and other Japanese right wingers so afraid of? After all, it's just a name right?
The names of geographical landmarks come and go. It's no big deal to change the name of East Sea at all. By opposing such a simple thing, Japan is exposing her stubborn attitude and reluctance to accept the fact her footprint and influence in Asia are shrinking faster than Toyota shares.
The name change is not out of hate. For Koreans, it is yet another way of washing away Japan's legacy of expansionism. It's not a bad thing at all.
Again, I wouldn't go so far as to say the East Sea is correct. However, I can see why Koreans would hate the name East Sea. For Japan to accept changing the name to a more neutral one it would be a great gesture of goodwill and peace.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteOnly Korean brainwashed fascism-like ethno-centrist claims the name of sea of Japan.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0skE1rsspc
Korean should change the name of Tongjoseonman to "East Sea" beacause considering the process of changing the recognization of "M
er de Coree".
http://sites.google.com/site/japanseamerdujapon/Home/the-process-mer-du-coree-become-broughton-bay-tongjoseonman-today-
http://sites.google.com/site/japanseamerdujapon/Home/korean-use-the-name-of-sea-of-japan-i
GTMOR, thank you for proving my point but you are being very silly.
ReplyDeleteMany of the historical records in which Koreans use the name ‘Sea of Japan’ were copied from Japanese sources originally. This is true of Chosun records such as the Dae Han Ji Ji that you use as ‘proof’ are not really Korean sources at all.
Thus it shows the use of ‘Sea of Japan’ stems from Japan’s dominance over Korea and northeast Asia.
You use Youtube for your historical research????
Personally, this silly "East Sea activity" is favorable to Japan's claim on Takeshima, since it expose how Korean are illogical and self-centered. However, I hope them to stop this since all the east-Asian including me are looked down from other part of the world because of this silliness.
ReplyDeleteFor Korea's own sake and for its future, Korean who has common sense and global view need to warn their kids to stay away from this kind of ego-centrism or ethno-centrism.
BTW, there is at least one person who has common sense in Korea. And it looks like he wasn't bashed or anything, so there must be many others who share with his view. From Korean "Finance Today" article. I hope singer Kim someone and so-called professor of 誠心女子大学 should liesten to what he says.
"동쪽 바다는 동해이고 서쪽 바다는 서해, 황하의 황톳물이 흘려내려 누런 빛깔을 띠기에 황해(黃海)라고 불리는 한반도 서쪽 바다의 경우 중국에서 보면 동해(東海)이고 한국 동쪽 바다의 경우도 일본이 보기에는 서해(西海), 그럼에도 불구하고 한반도 중심의 시각만을 내세워 중국인들이 황해를 서해라고 불러주기를 바라고 일본인들에게 일본해를 동해라고 부르라고 강요할 건가? 차라리 ‘한국해’라고 우기는 게 더 낫지 않은가? 젊은이들의 나라 사랑과 민족정신은 가상하기 짝이 없지만 그게 지나쳐서 ‘우물 안 개구리들의 자기생각’이라고 손가락질을 받을까봐 걱정된다.
진정한 국제화를 도모하여 한반도 우물 안에서 벗어나려면 자기중심적 사고부터 깨기 바란다. 정 억울하고 분하면 다른 민족 다른 국가들이 머리를 조아리게 만들 힘을 키우든지! 그럴 힘도 없으면서 자기 입장만 내세우면 비웃음밖에 돌아오는 게 없다."
cache
Steve (Dokdo-Takeshima) wrote:
ReplyDeleteKorea is not imposing a name on other people. She is trying to get the world and Japan to adopt a name for a geographical feature within the limits of her own territory. After all, considering both North and South Korea's EEZs the Koreas own about half of this body of water.
What do you think the word "imposing" means, Steve? Also, first you say the Sea of Japan is "within" Korean territory and then you admit that only half of it is within Korea's EEZs. You are talking out of both sides of your mouth.
Steve wrote:
Many of the historical records in which Koreans use the name ‘Sea of Japan’ were copied from Japanese sources originally. This is true of Chosun records such as the Dae Han Ji Ji that you use as ‘proof’ are not really Korean sources at all.
Thus it shows the use of ‘Sea of Japan’ stems from Japan’s dominance over Korea and northeast Asia.
Yes, as GTOMR pointed out HERE, even Korean textbooks before the turn of the 20th century were using the name "Sea of Japan." In fact, South Korea did not raise an objection to the name "Sea of Japan" until 1992, even though Korea had been independent and a member of IHO since 1957. South Korea did not even raise an objection to "Sea of Japan" in the 1986 draft of the IHO's "Limits of Oceans and Seas."
The truth is that anti-Japanese Koreans looking for new ways to bash Japan have only relatively recently come up with this "Sea of Japan" name-change scheme. Generally, Koreans do not really care what the sea is called as long as it does not have the name "Japan" in it, which suggests that Korean demands are based on prejudice, not history.
Prejudice should not be the basis for Koreans suddenly demanding the world stop using an overwhelmingly popular geographic name, which has been in international use since, at least, the early 1800s.
Here are more arguments against the name change from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Japan:
Sea of Japan
Gerry bevers,
ReplyDeleteI think Japan's MOFA's map inspection is excellent. But their explanation is not enough.
1 the relation about Strait of Korea and Sea of Japan.(Both two name become international standard almost same era .)
2)the process how Mer du Coree become Tongjoseonman(東朝鮮湾）, today's broughton Bay.
Ofcourse we know there are the name of Sea of Japan, Strait of Korea, and East (China) Sea.
Gif animation;
http://www16.tok2.com/home/otakeshimaoxdokdox/ANM/SeaOfJapan/Sea%20of%20japan%20naming%20dispute%20briefly.gif
I believe that the Korean of the good sense will not insist to change the name of the sea.
ReplyDelete2010.02.09
Mr Bevers, what I mean is, a country that possesses any geographical feature should be able to name it anything they want and the world should have to follow suit. Not the other way around. What is wrong with that? I support any country that wishes to give a name to rivers, lakes etc that lie within their boundaries.
ReplyDeleteAs I've said, if America wishes to lobby to change the name Gulf of Mexico, of if the French decide they wish to change the name English Chanel all the power to them. I feel this way in principle not just related to the Sea of Japan issue. It's not really a fair solution for Japan and the world to continue insist upon the name 'Sea of Japan' when it given at a time colonial nations dominated all of Northeast Asia.
Mr Bevers, as always, you fail to understand the relationship between Japan and Korea at the turn of the 20th Century. Korea was supposed to protest against Japan during the colonial era? Seriously anyone with even a rudimentary background of Japanese Korean history can see what a joke you are when you make such rubbish statements.
Here is the situation in Korea (Ulleungdo) in the early 20th Century.
Japan-Controls-Korea
Although the Koreans have historical basis for a name change it should really be their prerogative to name geographical features whatever the Hell they want if they lie within the limits of their territory Mr Bevers. Again, if Japan hates the name East Sea, they should work with Koreans to name this sea something they both can agree on.
Koreans didn't wait until 1992 to change the name? So what? I didn't know there was a statute of limitations on name changes of geographical features Mr Bevers. Korea wants to change the name. You also dodged my question. Why has the Japanese government invested so much time and effort in lobbying against this issue anyway? Maybe Japan is the problem here after all.
It's not surprising you've earned a reputation as being anti-Korean among the internet expat community. How much credibility do you think you have when you hotlink us to Japan's MOFA lobby page? Talk about exposing your bias.... The next time I hear to crow about how much you love Korea Mr Bevers, I swear I'm gonna lose my lunch.
mr.bevers,
ReplyDeletewith all due respect, i do not appreciate you calling koreans "petty". After all, your opinion on dokdo is only yours, and it doesn't allow you to provoke the koreans. I also think i can understand the korean's anger to the japs. I mean,imagine how the residents of dokdo and the rest of the koreans felt when suddenly the japaness demands their claims to dokdo?
Its the same thing to us if suddenly the japaness announced that hawaii belongs to them too. Would you still support the japs then? I think not.
Dude wrote:
ReplyDeleteu fucking person dokdo belongs to south korea!!!! there is evidence u bitch...so STOP PROVOKING KOREA
also,korean people have been living in dokdo since like a thousand years ago, AND SO FAR NO DIRTY JAPANESS SHITS HAVE BEEN LIVING IN DOKDO!!!!!! so shut ur shit!!
Now Dude writes:
with all due respect, i do not appreciate you calling koreans "petty". After all, your opinion on dokdo is only yours, and it doesn't allow you to provoke the koreans. I also think i can understand the korean's anger to the japs.
Hey, Dude, do you know the meaning of the word "hypocrisy" or that the word "jap" is a offensive term?
Dude,
ReplyDeleteThe island where Koreans were living for a thousand years is not Dokdo. They didn't know about the island until recently - they created the name of Dokdo only in 1904.
Speaking as a Korean, I do accept that it might not be proper for some countries to call it "East Sea", and they say Koreans are being illogical and self-centered about it. However, if you think like that, how do you think of Japan calling it "The Sea of Japan"? Isn't THAT illogical and self-centered? Why do they name it The Sea of Japan when it does not belong to them? Of course, most Koreans have minds of anti-japanese because of the past, but this is not an related issue. Koreans are supporting the "East Sea" movement not to say it belongs to any country, but to make a new name instead of a self-centered name. If it's just a name, why not name it as something else? After Japan succeeds in naming the sea "The Sea of Japan", they will soon start to call Dokdo their territory, and name it with ridiculous Japanese names, when it is certain that Dokdo is Korean territory based on many historical evidences. Other countries should support Korea's "East Sea" movement, and if they do not like this name, they should suggest a neutral name instead of saying that Korea is doing this movement out of hatred against Japan. Seriously, these people should learn about East Asia history properly to see why Koreans are being so sensitive about this matter.
ReplyDeleteHi, Shin
ReplyDeleteIt's good to hear from Korean like yourself. And I'm glad that you admit that "it might not be proper for some countries to call it "East Sea", and they say Koreans are being illogical and self-centered about it."
Yes, it's totally ignorant and ridiculous.
But if you really believe that the name "Sea of Japan" means "The sea is Janan's property," or whatever, why don't you have your own government appeal to the world for "making a new name instead of a self-centered name" for the name of "Korea Strait", which is not Korea's, apparently ?
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world. " by Mahatma Gandhi
It does not matter whether you support it or not it is not a MOVEMENT but a FACT. Where the hell did you get your information?
ReplyDelete大韓帝国の韓国の地誌における
ReplyDelete「日本海の記述」
https://sites.google.com/site/japanseamerdujapon/Home/korean-use-the-name-of-sea-of-japan-i